Can we start a dual state championship and more?

[Tommy James]

We all know that the AIA won’t give us exactly what we want anytime soon so how about as the actual wrestling community we create it. I see valiant is pushing the envelope to have a “one true champion” and I think it’s great. I’m not from AZ so I don’t really know all the drama that surrounds that issue but I do love that they are starting something. Can it be better? Of course but we got to start somewhere.

I think a dual state championship would be AWSOME.

What’s a list of things you would add to our state

1. One true champion
(who’s in favor of just one division)
2. Dual state championship
3. Girls should wrestle normal match’s just like the boys. They should be treated equally. My girls HATE the rules but it was a start and that’s great on the AIA part but I think we are the only state that has put training wheels on our girls(correct me if I’m wrong please)

What else is out there?

 

[Coachdoerr]

We all know that the AIA won’t give us exactly what we want anytime soon so how about as the actual wrestling community we create it. I see valiant is pushing the envelope to have a “one true champion” and I think it’s great. I’m not from AZ so I don’t really know all the drama that surrounds that issue but I do love that they are starting something. Can it be better? Of course but we got to start somewhere.

I think a dual state championship would be AWSOME.

What’s a list of things you would add to our state

1. One true champion
(who’s in favor of just one division)
2. Dual state championship
3. Girls should wrestle normal match’s just like the boys. They should be treated equally. My girls HATE the rules but it was a start and that’s great on the AIA part but I think we are the only state that has put training wheels on our girls(correct me if I’m wrong please)

What else is out there?

We use to have the dual state championship the week after individual state. As far as the girls. I hate the rules too but I’m glad we finally got them sanctioned here. I wish and want them to go 100% freestyle for the girls. Seeing that women’s college wrestling is freestyle

 

[Coach P]

Yeah, we did have a dual state for two years I think. About 8 - 10 years ago. It was ok....Individual proved to be more entertaining.

 

[Dad3wrestlers]

I would love to see the dual along with the actual State Championship, as for the girls they should be wrestling freestyle the only style they can wrestle in college and internationally, teach them early and let them grow the sport. It will help the wrestling community as a whole to get more kids, parents, coaches, teachers and schools involved.

 

[chingon76]

Freestyle makes the most sense. I’m not sure what safety precautions will be implemented for Aia sanctioned sport (headgear?suplex and similar throws?)
Personally girls should have headgear and hair coverings as optional. The same for Boys wrestling... hair does not impact a wrestlers performance. So many kids were kept from competing because of a seemingly 50s haircut rule. Lame.

 

[Tommy James]

That’s a great point about the Freestyle rules. I wonder how you go about promoting that. I think the AIA May have a problem with all the things that Chingon stated. If they can’t get the freestyle to pass then they should go full rules for folkstyle. It’s just really lame with the rules they have now. And am I the only one who thinks thier pace is too high? I mean no breaks ie coin flip, walking back to the center, change of position, out of bounds. I know there aren’t a lot of boys who can keep up at that pace. I’m glad we have it but no one in the country put training wheels in their first year.

We should bring back the dual state championships. College and other states do it all while keeping their Indy state tourney.

 

[wjd]

Dual state was a failure. There were only about 2-3 teams in each division that could realistically compete for the title. Everyone blames the AIA, but they are just a reflection of what the schools and ADs want. When everyone bitched about it being too hard to win championships they went with state tourneys where everyone qualified and we had too man divisions. Then it was too watered down so they switched to fewer divisions. Now the teams in each sections change every year to try and have a competitive balance, but it's always base do the previous years results so you end up with unbalanced state qualifiers every year.

I'm a diehard wrestling fan, but if the sport ever wants to reach the level of football, basketball and baseball, the coaches and ADs need to step up. Things like changing meet start times at the last minute because the JV match finished early are ridiculous. Have you ever seen a football or basketball game time moved up because everyone was ready and the coaches and administrators wanted to take advantage of the chance to get home earlier? Participation in the sport has been on the decline for years. Eliminate some weight classes, combine divisions and have 1 individual state tourney.

 

[Tommy James]

I do agree coach’s need to step it up. Good to see a lot of coach’s putting in that work. It would be nice to see a successful Dual state championship. I love the separate divisions but that’s just my opinion. A TOC tournament like what valiant/thoroughbred is hosting this week is great to see who the real state champ is.

 

[Coachdoerr]

Freestyle makes the most sense. I’m not sure what safety precautions will be implemented for Aia sanctioned sport (headgear?suplex and similar throws?)
Personally girls should have headgear and hair coverings as optional. The same for Boys wrestling... hair does not impact a wrestlers performance. So many kids were kept from competing because of a seemingly 50s haircut rule. Lame.

Should be just like any other freestyle tournament HG is not mandatory and you can not throw from the back either front or side. Should not be any issues as far as safety 6 year old kids wrestle tons of freestyle matches in a day. I am no fan of the 5 matches per day. When a kid can go to Fargo and wrestle 10 plus matches in a day and no mandatory rest time in between.

 

[Coachdoerr]

Dual state was a failure. There were only about 2-3 teams in each division that could realistically compete for the title. Everyone blames the AIA, but they are just a reflection of what the schools and ADs want. When everyone bitched about it being too hard to win championships they went with state tourneys where everyone qualified and we had too man divisions. Then it was too watered down so they switched to fewer divisions. Now the teams in each sections change every year to try and have a competitive balance, but it's always base do the previous years results so you end up with unbalanced state qualifiers every year.

I'm a diehard wrestling fan, but if the sport ever wants to reach the level of football, basketball and baseball, the coaches and ADs need to step up. Things like changing meet start times at the last minute because the JV match finished early are ridiculous. Have you ever seen a football or basketball game time moved up because everyone was ready and the coaches and administrators wanted to take advantage of the chance to get home earlier? Participation in the sport has been on the decline for years. Eliminate some weight classes, combine divisions and have 1 individual state tourney.

We only had the everyone goes state tournament one year here. There has been 4 divisions here forever As far as schools changing divisions because of competition that’s not true. A school is put into a certain division based on their enrollment of course there is always an exception to the rule but for the most part that’s the way it goes. As far as where I coach we have to travel everywhere we go so if we can start a little earlier I am all for that it takes a toll on everyone when you get home at 2:00am and then get up for school 4 hours later

 

[Richard Lopez]

I don’t understand why everyone in our state knocks the progress we’ve made.

In the past 10-15 years, Arizona as a state have greatly improved.

• there’s no more match cap limits for Hs wrestling and we added a 5th tournament.
• we now have 2 JH state tournaments.
• we now have a full USA folkstyle and freestyle schedule.
•we added the Tucson USA wrestling schedule.
• we now have 2 Rocky Mountain National tournaments in arizona.
• we have more elite year round clubs such as Cyclones, Grindhouse, Thorobred, Sunkist, fight ready etc.
• we’re sending full Teams to western regionals, nationals dual tournaments, virgina beach and Fargo.
• we added woman’s wrestling.
•there’s wrestling’s camps/clinics through out the state.

Arizona wrestlers aren’t scared to compete against the best.

They’ve been wrestling each other throughout USA wrestling, JH and HS.

We’re finally hitting our stride. We’re getting more elite kids finally filtering through HS on a consistent basis.

Opportunities are there. Stop bashing the kids that don’t have the same passion as you.

Keep up the good work.

 

[Tommy James]

I don’t understand why everyone in our state knocks the progress we’ve made.

In the past 10-15 years, Arizona as a state have greatly improved.

• there’s no more match cap limits for Hs wrestling and we added a 5th tournament.
• we now have 2 JH state tournaments.
• we now have a full USA folkstyle and freestyle schedule.
•we added the Tucson USA wrestling schedule.
• we now have 2 Rocky Mountain National tournaments in arizona.
• we have more elite year round clubs such as Cyclones, Grindhouse, Thorobred, Sunkist, fight ready etc.
• we’re sending full Teams to western regionals, nationals dual tournaments, virgina beach and Fargo.
• we added woman’s wrestling.
•there’s wrestling’s camps/clinics through out the state.

Arizona wrestlers aren’t scared to compete against the best.

They’ve been wrestling each other throughout USA wrestling, JH and HS.

We’re finally hitting our stride. We’re getting more elite kids finally filtering through HS on a consistent basis.

Opportunities are there. Stop bashing the kids that don’t have the same passion as you.

Keep up the good work.

Those are great points. We aren’t bashing the kids at all (don’t know where that came from. Well I’m not) I do agree about having these conversation and pushing the envelop. That’s how things get done, first you talk about it to get the data and then you go to work. Closed mouths don’t get fed. The State of AZ has great things happening. We can always make it better.

 

[Tommy James]

We only had the everyone goes state tournament one year here. There has been 4 divisions here forever As far as schools changing divisions because of competition that’s not true. A school is put into a certain division based on their enrollment of course there is always an exception to the rule but for the most part that’s the way it goes. As far as where I coach we have to travel everywhere we go so if we can start a little earlier I am all for that it takes a toll on everyone when you get home at 2:00am and then get up for school 4 hours later

I for one love to get my guys out early. If we can get all 4-5 Duals in by 7 I’m all for it. Get these kids home and we’ll rested.

 

[Richard Lopez]

Those are great points. We aren’t bashing the kids at all (don’t know where that came from. Well I’m not) I do agree about having these conversation and pushing the envelop. That’s how things get done, first you talk about it to get the data and then you go to work. Closed mouths don’t get fed. The State of AZ has great things happening. We can always make it better.

I was speaking in general and referring to the other threads. I should have made it clear. I agree with everything you stated. Share ideas and made progress.

 

[Tommy James]

I actually see what you may be referring to and it does need to stop. We can only provide an experience that we feel would be fun and beneficial to the kids. Weather or not they want to participate in it is their choice. Just let the good times roll. Calling kids chicken, weak, or division champs and not state champs is no bueno. If this isn’t what your referring to just disregard they entire thing

 

[az_wrestler]

I don’t understand why everyone in our state knocks the progress we’ve made.

In the past 10-15 years, Arizona as a state have greatly improved.

• there’s no more match cap limits for Hs wrestling and we added a 5th tournament.
• we now have 2 JH state tournaments.
• we now have a full USA folkstyle and freestyle schedule.
•we added the Tucson USA wrestling schedule.
• we now have 2 Rocky Mountain National tournaments in arizona.
• we have more elite year round clubs such as Cyclones, Grindhouse, Thorobred, Sunkist, fight ready etc.
• we’re sending full Teams to western regionals, nationals dual tournaments, virgina beach and Fargo.
• we added woman’s wrestling.
•there’s wrestling’s camps/clinics through out the state.

Arizona wrestlers aren’t scared to compete against the best.

They’ve been wrestling each other throughout USA wrestling, JH and HS.

We’re finally hitting our stride. We’re getting more elite kids finally filtering through HS on a consistent basis.

Opportunities are there. Stop bashing the kids that don’t have the same passion as you.

Keep up the good work.[/QUO


What about adding a true second to the State Tourney? There were some 3rd placers that did or could beat the runner-up...just saying lets perfect the AZ State Tourney.

 

[az_wrestler]

do a Tru 2nd at state!

 

[Coach Pat]

do a Tru 2nd at state!

I don't know about true second at state, but we should definitely do a true second at sectionals.

As far as matches, I do think we need to make it more like football and basketball. Multis get guys matches but it's those Duals at a start time where parents can actually show up that I think a lot of people want to see. I understand that some schools won't fill a team and so Duals may not work, but for those of us that have full rosters we need to encourage dual matches at later times in my opinion